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Post by gln826 on Feb 11, 2017 13:49:09 GMT -5
A some mid round guys I am starting to like already: Daeshon Hall DE Kevin King CB (early mid-lol) Chad Wheeler OT (liked for a while) Adam Bisnowaty OT Alex Anzalone ILB Samaje Perine RB Cordrea Tankersley CB Pharaoh Brown TE (for a while too) Obi Melifonwu S (LB in nickel/dime) Trey Hendrickson DE
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Post by macspak on Feb 11, 2017 19:02:23 GMT -5
I also have DE as a priority. Someone opposite of Trey Flowers who can put pressure would give us a legit defense and great front 4 to go with Brown, Valentine and Branch if he comes back. An athletic LB is also goo because it allows Van Noy more pass rushing time as well and he seems to do well rushing the QB. Any free agents that people like that would like us to bring in? Haven't studied that yet but probably a good time to do so. Have you found any sites providing full team lists of FA's? finally took a look. None thrill me except for those we can't/won't pursue like Ingram DE from Chargers. Jefferson S from AZ is the right age, 25, and ascending but not if we keep Harmon. Warford would be nice but I believe wemust allow Thuney, Mason, Karras, Jackson etc. develop. To be truthful the ones I like are ours and we are in a great spot to retain all of them since we have the cap money but do we have the will? We know BB loves value. My guess is this is the year where BB slightly bends his rules to retain our best. Whether that works or not I don't see him spending a lot on other team FAS's. He will continue signing those under the radar and lost in the shuffle. The second and third tier after crazy money is spent on the first tier. I suspect he will target those in their mid 20's and also look for those cast off by other teams.
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Post by macspak on Feb 11, 2017 19:22:50 GMT -5
TE - back-ups and out of favor
Cas pointed to Rivera from Oakland. Luke Wilson from Seattle. Doyle from Colts. RFA from Eagles Trey Burton. What's the Eagles cap situation? Could this be a Hogan type signing?
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Post by macspak on Feb 11, 2017 19:39:36 GMT -5
Jonathan Hankins DT NYG 25 coming off down year after an injury in 2016. Zach Brown ILB Bills - outstanding 2016. Kiko Alonso LB Miami. Talented but sporadic. Darius Butler, bring him back for a year or two.
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Post by macspak on Feb 11, 2017 19:46:11 GMT -5
Do you guys realize how poor the QB FA class is? Combined with the questions regarding all the college QB's coming out...... like the perfect storm for JG to be trade bait along with so many teams with need and draft capital.
I thought this comment I recently saw was great as what our beginning asking price should be:
a 1st and a 4th and $1,000,000.
Hah - justice. God, could Deflategate have backfired any greater on the NFL. We win two SB's and showcase JG who will return as much, probably greater, capital than they stripped/stole from us. Be careful of what you wish for....
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Post by macspak on Feb 11, 2017 20:05:48 GMT -5
Thielien MN 27 RFA slot receiver with great quickness. Don't see the need unless instead of restructuring DA we cut him but after his SB performance and overall clutch play how do we do that? Because BB is heartless and looks forward not backwards. I think JE is 30 and DA 31 and both are FA's after next year but would that longer term need be better served in the draft?
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Post by macspak on Feb 11, 2017 20:14:06 GMT -5
Now that we've cleared the contract hurdle, let's examine the risk. Garoppolo has started just two NFL games and thrown fewer than 100 passes in NFL three seasons. Isn't irresponsible to part with a first-round pick -- or more -- without a greater sample size?
How does that qualify as more risky than surrendering two first-round picks, two second-round picks and two third-round picks as the Rams did for the opportunity to gamble on a quarterback with zero starts and zero attempts? Teams have no qualms about overpaying for unproven college prospects. It doesn't matter how the solution is found. Sustained NFL success correlates to steady quarterback performance whereas exhaustive searches for a solution to professional sports' most valuable position deplete resources otherwise spent stockpiling talent.
Acknowledging that the value of a legitimate young franchise quarterback is beyond calculable, how can Jackson, Shanahan and Pace be so sure that Garoppolo fits that description? Is there reason to believe he's a better bet for post-New England success than former Brady backups such as Matt Cassel, Brian Hoyer and Ryan Mallett? The answer is a resounding yes. When Shanahan was running the Browns offense in 2014, he ranked Garoppolo just behind Derek Carr as the second-best prospect in the draft.
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Post by macspak on Feb 11, 2017 20:15:22 GMT -5
Wouldn't be surprised if we get Cleveland's 1-12, an early 2nd next year, and a player.
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Post by macspak on Feb 11, 2017 20:31:07 GMT -5
give me Calais Campbell over Chandler Jones. For the next two years.
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Post by macspak on Feb 11, 2017 21:03:32 GMT -5
Joel Bitonio G, Barnidge TE, Nassib DL, Paea DT, Haden CB, Shelton DL - would BB have any interest in any of these Cleveland players?
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Post by gln826 on Feb 12, 2017 8:36:31 GMT -5
Joel Bitonio G, Barnidge TE, Nassib DL, Paea DT, Haden CB, Shelton DL - would BB have any interest in any of these Cleveland players? Would love Haden, but his contract is huge! Those DTs would have seemed good, but being last against the run in the NFL....nope!
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Post by gln826 on Feb 12, 2017 9:37:32 GMT -5
So far, for where we are picking in the draft, I see these edge guys as being the Pats 1st pick: Tim Williams, Carl Lawson, JT Watt, and Ryan Anderson (this order).
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Post by macspak on Feb 12, 2017 11:55:09 GMT -5
What do you know about Watt, other than his name?
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Post by gln826 on Feb 12, 2017 13:52:23 GMT -5
What do you know about Watt, other than his name? Already have been seeing highlights. I like his size and he has decent speed, always seem to be around the ball. I do need to see more when he isn't around the ball, but just with his length, he covers a lot of space in the zone.
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Post by oforilly on Feb 13, 2017 9:04:24 GMT -5
I just started looking at draft prospects so I'm behind the eight ball, but good to see we have an extremely deep DLINE & WIDE RECEIVER Class.
Aaron Jones Running Back is DLewis & White all in one.. I was a big Dixon and Prosiece fan (spelling) and upset Ravens & Hawks took them. I think Jones is better than both.
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Post by brian2783 on Feb 13, 2017 9:15:39 GMT -5
Joel Bitonio G, Barnidge TE, Nassib DL, Paea DT, Haden CB, Shelton DL - would BB have any interest in any of these Cleveland players? Would love Haden, but his contract is huge! Those DTs would have seemed good, but being last against the run in the NFL....nope! Shelton was actually pretty good....the rest were terrible. I'd take Shelton in a heart beat and use him in Akiem Hicks role... Barnidge would be great as well....No on Haden. Injuries have pretty much ruined him.
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Post by brian2783 on Feb 13, 2017 9:18:57 GMT -5
Thielien MN 27 RFA slot receiver with great quickness. Don't see the need unless instead of restructuring DA we cut him but after his SB performance and overall clutch play how do we do that? Because BB is heartless and looks forward not backwards. I think JE is 30 and DA 31 and both are FA's after next year but would that longer term need be better served in the draft? Love Theilen. A lot of Hogan in that kid mixed with some JE. I'd take a stab at him if Floyd walks. I agree about age at WR. I love Dola but we have to look ahead and Thielen would be an upgrade over him in the near future.
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Post by brian2783 on Feb 13, 2017 9:20:44 GMT -5
So far, for where we are picking in the draft, I see these edge guys as being the Pats 1st pick: Tim Williams, Carl Lawson, JT Watt, and Ryan Anderson (this order). Any tape on Taco Charlton (sp?) seems all over the place on 1st round. Or Wormley the other Michigan guy?
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Post by brian2783 on Feb 13, 2017 9:24:41 GMT -5
Now that we've cleared the contract hurdle, let's examine the risk. Garoppolo has started just two NFL games and thrown fewer than 100 passes in NFL three seasons. Isn't irresponsible to part with a first-round pick -- or more -- without a greater sample size? How does that qualify as more risky than surrendering two first-round picks, two second-round picks and two third-round picks as the Rams did for the opportunity to gamble on a quarterback with zero starts and zero attempts? Teams have no qualms about overpaying for unproven college prospects. It doesn't matter how the solution is found. Sustained NFL success correlates to steady quarterback performance whereas exhaustive searches for a solution to professional sports' most valuable position deplete resources otherwise spent stockpiling talent. Acknowledging that the value of a legitimate young franchise quarterback is beyond calculable, how can Jackson, Shanahan and Pace be so sure that Garoppolo fits that description? Is there reason to believe he's a better bet for post-New England success than former Brady backups such as Matt Cassel, Brian Hoyer and Ryan Mallett? The answer is a resounding yes. When Shanahan was running the Browns offense in 2014, he ranked Garoppolo just behind Derek Carr as the second-best prospect in the draft. Its quite simple really.....He has shown more in the pros than any college prospect....add that the QB class comes in with no clear #1 QB prospect and JG at his age and price, because he won't demand franchise QB money yet...more like Osweiler money makes hima perfect candidate. He's proven that he can make all the throws and read....albeit in small samples....JG is easily worth a 1st round pick and then some.
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Post by macspak on Feb 13, 2017 19:16:50 GMT -5
Peter King came out again, in today's column, stating he does not believe BB will trade JG.......
How do you NOT trade JG this offseason?
Anybody see Solder's stats from the SB: 1 sack, 1 hit and 11 pressures. Had Brady running for his life. Combine that with Grady Jarrett's 3 sacks....... How the hell did we win that SB?
Never been a big Solder fan. Thought the hype about his size, arm length and athleticism far outweighed his actual production. Seeing that he is older and regressing and everyone else on the OL is young and presumably progressing, Solder/L OT is the lines weak link.
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Post by oforilly on Feb 14, 2017 12:24:17 GMT -5
Jarred Davis and Jabrill Peppers are close in talents.
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Post by oriolebill on Feb 15, 2017 9:09:27 GMT -5
Peter King came out again, in today's column, stating he does not believe BB will trade JG....... How do you NOT trade JG this offseason? Anybody see Solder's stats from the SB: 1 sack, 1 hit and 11 pressures. Had Brady running for his life. Combine that with Grady Jarrett's 3 sacks....... How the hell did we win that SB? Never been a big Solder fan. Thought the hype about his size, arm length and athleticism far outweighed his actual production. Seeing that he is older and regressing and everyone else on the OL is young and presumably progressing, Solder/L OT is the lines weak link. The only way that you don't trade Garoppolo is if you know that Brady is only going one more year. In every other scenario, you take what you can get for him and run. Run because what you'll get for him is a lot. Given the state of the QB position in the NFL someone will overpay. Desperation will prompt someone to offer a King's ransom for the possibility that Garoppolo is the answer for seven to ten years. To me that means a #1 and change. How much change is conditioned on the level of desperation an organization has. That said, I would have more confidence in making the move if I knew that my coordinator would run an offense similar to New England's. I would want to maximize the likelihood of success coming out of the gate.
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Post by oriolebill on Feb 15, 2017 9:55:50 GMT -5
I've been on the strengthen the O-line bandwagon for a while. Like Mac and others here I have not been impressed with Solder (more hype than substance) and I feel like Mason was regressing in pass protection during the second half of the year. I'm not confident that he can be coached up. So I'd consider a trade for Bitonio. I thought he played well given that they got nothing from the center position. I really liked him coming out of college.
I love Dan Freeney (Indiana) really good in pass pro (concerned about the concussion) and like Orlosky (WVU) (although I don't think center is a position of need). With his issues Cam Robinson may drop. I think Pocic moves to guard in the NFL.
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Post by macspak on Feb 15, 2017 11:45:11 GMT -5
Peter King came out again, in today's column, stating he does not believe BB will trade JG....... How do you NOT trade JG this offseason? Anybody see Solder's stats from the SB: 1 sack, 1 hit and 11 pressures. Had Brady running for his life. Combine that with Grady Jarrett's 3 sacks....... How the hell did we win that SB? Never been a big Solder fan. Thought the hype about his size, arm length and athleticism far outweighed his actual production. Seeing that he is older and regressing and everyone else on the OL is young and presumably progressing, Solder/L OT is the lines weak link. The only way that you don't trade Garoppolo is if you know that Brady is only going one more year. In every other scenario, you take what you can get for him and run. Run because what you'll get for him is a lot. Given the state of the QB position in the NFL someone will overpay. Desperation will prompt someone to offer a King's ransom for the possibility that Garoppolo is the answer for seven to ten years. To me that means a #1 and change. How much change is conditioned on the level of desperation an organization has. That said, I would have more confidence in making the move if I knew that my coordinator would run an offense similar to New England's. I would want to maximize the likelihood of success coming out of the gate. How about Cleveland's first 2nd round and first 3rd rd picks and their 3rd next year giving us #32, 33, 64, 65, 96 and 104?? or #33 and #65 and Bitonio? or any of those combinations and if we lose Bennett or as a hedge against Barnidge instead?
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Post by brian2783 on Feb 15, 2017 16:12:27 GMT -5
The only way that you don't trade Garoppolo is if you know that Brady is only going one more year. In every other scenario, you take what you can get for him and run. Run because what you'll get for him is a lot. Given the state of the QB position in the NFL someone will overpay. Desperation will prompt someone to offer a King's ransom for the possibility that Garoppolo is the answer for seven to ten years. To me that means a #1 and change. How much change is conditioned on the level of desperation an organization has. That said, I would have more confidence in making the move if I knew that my coordinator would run an offense similar to New England's. I would want to maximize the likelihood of success coming out of the gate. How about Cleveland's first 2nd round and first 3rd rd picks and their 3rd next year giving us #32, 33, 64, 65, 96 and 104?? or #33 and #65 and Bitonio? or any of those combinations and if we lose Bennett or as a hedge against Barnidge instead? I'd take #12 #65 and Barnidge. or 12# #96 and 3# next year
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Post by brian2783 on Feb 15, 2017 16:14:05 GMT -5
I've heard that Chicago Would move down from #3 overall and then flip that return or some packaged of that return for JG
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Post by gln826 on Feb 16, 2017 18:22:19 GMT -5
So far, for where we are picking in the draft, I see these edge guys as being the Pats 1st pick: Tim Williams, Carl Lawson, JT Watt, and Ryan Anderson (this order). Any tape on Taco Charlton (sp?) seems all over the place on 1st round. Or Wormley the other Michigan guy? so far, what I've seen of Taco, I am not that overly impressed. Don't get me wrong, kid can play (LDE), and seems to get better later in games. He can lock down pretty when forced to, but gives up contain too often with a couple inside moves (a la Sheard), he loves the spin move. Most of his sacks seems to be unblocked or against statues. IMO, not a 1st rounder. Wormley.....haven't seen enough on him, but what I have....something seems off. Seems like he has good tools, size and decent speed, but something doesn't feel right. Looks to get lost in the middle when pass rushing. I don't know if DT is his position, maybe a LDE in a 3-4. But no better than a 3rd rounder.
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Post by macspak on Feb 16, 2017 20:34:28 GMT -5
I've heard that Chicago Would move down from #3 overall and then flip that return or some packaged of that return for JG might make sense if they can find the right trading partner. If no QB's are worth trading up for who is? RB's Cook or Fournette? There is a risk for Chicago IF the Browns or SF aggressively pursue JG. (What other top 10 - 15 teams need a QB?) trading the 3rd or too far down could take them out of the running. I've said from the beginning that competition will create the best market and value for JG.
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Post by gln826 on Feb 19, 2017 8:26:59 GMT -5
Changed my mind on a DE/OLB with the 1st pick. Raekwon McMillian is the guy I want! This guy is nonstop, even against Clemson, he and the CB's were the only ones playing to the last whistle. I think he can play inside and outside. He looks more athletic than Jamie Collins and plays his position.
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Post by gln826 on Feb 19, 2017 10:27:36 GMT -5
So far, for where we are picking in the draft, I see these edge guys as being the Pats 1st pick: Tim Williams, Carl Lawson, JT Watt, and Ryan Anderson (this order). Any tape on Taco Charlton (sp?) seems all over the place on 1st round. Or Wormley the other Michigan guy? I like Charles Harris a lot better than Taco. Looks to be a better/quick twitch athlete. But I can see Harris being gone around 20.
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